Phoenix Network Forums

I'm not sure if this subject fits here in the serious discussion area.

Government demanding search records from search engines.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2006/01/20/MNGEVGQED31.DTL
I was reading this article and some other ones concerning the government demanding the search engines like Google turn over the searches that their users are making. They cite that its to crack down on child pornography on the internet, and I agree with that, it needs to stop. But privacy adovcates are saying that it could encompass much more than just that. What do you think? Is the government taking things too far?

In my opinion it's not no way close to right that the goverment want's such data from google or anyother search engine. Don't our rights count in any way at all? I mean come on. But then again you only see this kind of stuff going on in America I don't know of any of those thing happening here in Europe or i'm just not informed about it. It's ok if they only look for people that upload child porn (as you said) or murder price lists as i once saw on the news, but they should leave the others alone, but it will usually consult in drastic messures so the inocent will get "fu*ed" and the rest will continue with their work.

That's right Goverment continue on RIAA's path and sue 14 year olds for lot's of money! Useless #$&$%

Greets.

I don't see any reason not to hand them over.

I don't see what rights are infringed when a government acquires any online data about me.

I don't see the big deal.


imo, if you have nothing to hide, you will not care if some distant weirdo goes as far as to read your emails, see what your searching for. If you do have something to hide, you will naturally protest against it. The right to privacy argument in this sence is beyond me, what is so bad about recording online habits?

to say that I shouldnt fear if I have nothing to hide is just poor reasoning...you shouldnt live under the asumption that the goverment has the power and the right to poke through your personal life at their leisure. This country was founded on the princable that the government would be controled by the people not vice versa and even though it is not specifially spelled out in the constitution or the bill of rights it was implied by our founders that a person in this country is entitled to have their privacy. This is most notable given in the privacy act or 1979 when the supreme court and congress expressly said that no government agency should enfringe on a citizens privacy without due cause.

Great, so it's a law not to infring one's privacy. Whopee. But what I don't see is what is the problem that it would cause if it weren't illegal? Some guy would read I don't like aunt sophie, I had diarrhoea yesterday and I'm getting a new tv. Err, lol.

A country may have been founded on many principles, but all of them may have changed overtime. Democracies today work in the manner of: The people are controlled by the government which has been elected by the people. Sort of like a by the people at the people thing.

Implied or not, it makes no difference if the written law is different.

Samppa wrote:Great, so it's a law not to infring one's privacy. Whopee. But what I don't see is what is the problem that it would cause if it weren't illegal? Some guy would read I don't like aunt sophie, I had diarrhoea yesterday and I'm getting a new tv. Err, lol.

A country may have been founded on many principles, but all of them may have changed overtime. Democracies today work in the manner of: The people are controlled by the government which has been elected by the people. Sort of like a by the people at the people thing.

Implied or not, it makes no difference if the written law is different.

I agree - it's a catch 22. We want the government to protect us from people with nuclear bombs strapped to their whatevers....but we don't want to give up our freedom. How is the government suppose to protect us if they can't investigate people who are calling up Osama and friends? As long as I am not calling them - I should be OK. But on the other hand, if this type of snoopery is legalized - then when some crazed socialist gets elected president - what will they do with all that information? I think old George Washington is rolling over in his grave right about now.

I really don't care how innocent my emails may be, it's private and I don't want some fascists looking through them. That is what our govt. has become, fascists. While our country falls apart they distract us with anything they can. Sorry but I demand to see a warrant before they look through anything of mine.

The argument that it's no big deal if you have nothing to hide is naive. Once they get their claws in the door, they never stop. It will soon get to the point where they can walk into our house and start snooping around. Would you want that?

How would it progress to that?

You're naive if you think it would, the people are not headless chickens who will do everything they are told.

Altough, that reminds of something that got me thinking.. Even though this is cutting the head off of my own argument, I'll come out with it.

If the government is indeed allowed to look through the personal files and communications of people, how would the people then plan a revolt when the powers that be have access to all their lines of communication?
Even though it's practically impossible to monitor the communications of everyone unless you have as many monitors as you have people, which would eventually lead to the revolt of the monitors as well, leaving the government helpless, it's concrete theory that will scare people.

I can't remember where it was, but I saw a site which showed a small sample of about 1000 google searches and updated them daily. After reading through the list, I realised that people don't really have anything to hide as most of the searches were regarding simple issues like installing software etc.

I was expecting to see a lot more "hot asian girls xxx" but surprisingly, there were very few.

Samppa wrote:If the government is indeed allowed to look through the personal files and communications of people, how would the people then plan a revolt when the powers that be have access to all their lines of communication?
Even though it's practically impossible to monitor the communications of everyone unless you have as many monitors as you have people, which would eventually lead to the revolt of the monitors as well, leaving the government helpless, it's concrete theory that will scare people.

That's why Citizen Band radio is loved by those with tinfoil hats